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PETER A. NIELSEN RMCMI PRESIDENT 1991-1992 on behalf of the RMCMI Board of Directors and Officers of The Rocky Mountain Coal Mining Institute cordially invites you and your family to attend the 88th Regular Meeting and Convention to be held June 28-30, 1992 Tamarron, Durango, Colorado

Jan 1, 1991

[ADDISON, HERBERT Big Horn Collieries Co., Colo. Bldg., Denver, Colo. ALEXANDER, JOHN 825 So. Gaylord St., Denver, Colo. ALLAN, DAVID Lafayette, Colo. ALLEN, JOHN Ludlow, Colo. ALLEY, GERALD Box 1920, Denver, Colo. ALLISON, ARCHIE Box 562, Walsenburg, Colo. ALLISON, D. S 1331 Roberta St., Salt Lake City, Utah AMBLER, J. B c-o Ambler & Riter, Kearns Bldg., Salt Lake City, Utah ANDERSON, A. E 403 Ideal Bldg., Denver, Colo. ANDERSON, FRANK Crosby, Wyo. ANDREWS, SAM Box 91, Walsenburg, Colo. ANGUS, WILLIAM -o B. W. Snodgrass, 1575 Lafayette St., Denver, Colo. APPERSON, A. B Tramway Bldg., Denver, Colo. ARMSTRONG, C. D 420 U. S. Natl. Bank Bldg., Denver, Colo.]

Jan 1, 1926

Jan 1, 2001

Jan 1, 1976

[President Vernal Mortensen Vice Presidents Colorado Charles W. Margolf Montana Art K. Neill New Mexico Robert Diederick North Dakota James A. Brown Utah Bernard Bernstrom Wyoming John T. Goodier Secretary-Treasurer Doris G. Finnie Executive Board Roy Coulson A. Z. Dimitroff Claude P. Heiner J. R. Kastler Loren V. Linville Shirl C. McArthur Ira E. McKeever, Jr. Ralph E. Moore Robert E. Murray V. O. Murray George A. Nugent John Peperakis John A. Reeves Max A. Robb Joe T. Taylor R. M. von Storch R. R. Williams, Jr. Robert W. Wilson Mike Zakotnik, Jr. Edward F. Ziolkowski]

Jan 1, 1982

The Friday morning session of, the Forty-seventh Meeting of the Rocky Mountain Coal Mining Institute was called, to order in the junior Ballroom, Hotel Utah, Salt Lake City, Utah, at 9:20 o'clock a. in., with Mr. Paul L. Shields presiding. CHAIRMAN SHIELDS: Let us get started, gentlemen. We are late now. From the looks of this agenda we are going to have a busy forenoon. The first item on this program is a talk on "The Second Underground. Gasification Experiment at Gorgas, Alabama," by Mr. James L. Elder.

Jan 1, 1951

The Third Session of the Forty-Sixth Meeting of the Rocky Mountain Coal Mining Institute convened at the Hotel Colorado, Glenwood Springs, Colorado, June' 20, 1950, at 9:30 a.m., G. E. Sorenson, President, presiding. PRESIDENT SORENSON: The meeting will come to order. To refresh your memory, I will read off the names of the people on the various committees. President Sorenson read off the names on the committees. Mr. Whiteside, do you wish to make an announcement? MR. WHITESIDE: Yes, I would like to 'say a word. .4s you know, this afternoon you will be on your own, and I think some would like to go to Rifle. I wonder if we could get a vote on that now as to how many would like to go to Rifle, as they at Rifle would like to know so they can provide conveyances. There seems to be about 14 or 16 that would like to go to Rifle.

Jan 1, 1950

Amercable, Inc. Andalex Resources, Inc. ARCO Coal Company Behre Dolbear & Company, Inc. Colowyo Coal Co. L.P. Continental Conveyor & Equipment Company Crane & Hoist Sales Crested Butte Mountain Resort Cyprus Amax Coal Co. Energy West Mining Company The Falkirk Mining Company Fleischli Oil Co. Inc. Halbach & Braun Industries Hemscheidt Corporation GH Henley Industries Ingersoll-Rand Co. Jennmar Corporation Joy Technologies, Inc. K & P Sales Engineers, Inc. Kennametal, Inc. Kerr-McGee Coal Corporation L & H Welding & Machine Co. McLanahan Corporation National Coal Association The North American Coal Corporation Northwestern Resources Company Peabody Western Coal Company Phillips Machine Service Pincock Allen & Holt Ramsey Technology, Inc. Rust Tractor Company Salt River Project Schroeder Industries Stamler Corporation TerraMatrix TIC (The Industrial Company Wyoming, Inc.) Trapper Mining Inc. Wagner Equipment Company Western Energy Company Wheeler Machinery Company

Jan 1, 1994

[ALLISON, D. S.. ...................... ,1331 Roberta St., Salt-Lake City, Utah AMBLER, J. B.. ........ c-o Ambler & Riter, Kearns Bldg., Salt Lake City, Utah ANDERSON, A. E.. ................ ,403 Midland Savings Bldg., Denver, Colo. ANDERSON, ARTHUR E.. .. .Colorado Utilities Corp., Steamboat Springs, Colo. ANDERSON, FRANK ........................................... Crosby, Wyo. ANGUS, WILLIAM.. ........... .99 South Downing St., Apt. 204, Denver, Colo. APPERSON, A. B.. ............................ .Tramway Bldg., Denver, Colo. ]

Jan 1, 1928

Jan 1, 1995

Jan 1, 1955

By Wm. Monay

MR. MONAY (Vice President Kinney Coal Co., Scofield, Utah): The past year and a half has witnessed a series of coal mine disasters in Utah and Wyoming, concentrated into the short space of a few months, following a long period of years in which the industry was comparatively free from devastating calamities. The natural result has been a hysterical activity on the part of bureaus, commissions and professional reformers who know little about coal mining from a practical standpoint. This activity has been met by the industry in Utah with an attitude of submission, no doubt the result of the fear of being misunderstood by the public. But it is my firm conviction that the lives and property of the coal industry will find their surest guaranty of protection in the humanity, and in the self interest of those operating and working in the mines, rather than in governmental regulation. Inelastic, inflexible blanket statutes and rules will simply stifle and hamper the initiative and progress of our industry in working out its own salvation, under the varying and changing conditions of different localities, different conditions, and in different mines. We who have spent our lives in digging in the mines and operating them, know more about this business than anyone else and I believe it is time for us to speak up and no longer sit meekly by while inexperienced bureaus and unskilled commissions make up laws, rules and regulations for us which when made are on the books to stay, even though in a short time they may prove inapplicable, in whole or in part, or be superseded by something different, and which in some cases create new dangers or lull us into a false sense of security. Shortly after the Castle Gate explosion in March, 1924, a new set of safety rules was issued by the Indus- trial Commission of the State of Utah to become effective July 1st of the same year, the most important of which prohibits the use of black powder in any mine--gaseous or non-gaseous; prohibits the use of open flame lamps in any mine-gaseous or non-gaseous; and requires that rock dusting in all main haulage ways as far as the freezing point and required that all mining machines be equipped with water to be applied while cutting. These rules have been characterized as "Utah's Monument to her Dead Miners" in a large poster spread broadcast over the country from an office in New York that styles itself the Association for Labor Legislation. In reviewing the coal mining history of the State of Utah, in the year 1900, a serious disaster occurred at Winter Quarters. The cause of the same is believed to be an explosion of powder that was stored in the mine, which was a common practice in the early days, and from that time until the Castle Gate disaster, March 8, 1924, a period of some twenty-four years, no explosion of any kind occurred in this district. During all this period open lamps were used, considerable black powder was used, rock dusting was unheard of, sprinkling with water was very generally done-all without any catastrophe. Since the adoption of the new rules, we have 'had a very violent explosion at the Carbon Fuel mine in Spring Canyon. At the time of this explosion, 3,000 feet of the main slope had been rock dusted several times between July 1st and September 21st. The second left entry, which is a main haulage way, a distance of 3,000 feet was completely rock dusted on the date of the explosion. This mine is not considered extremely gaseous, yet an explosion as violent as that of the Castle Gate mine occurred. Some thirty men who had been loading coal in various parts of the mine on this Sun- day, the day of the explosion, and other men employed in rock dusting the second left entry, had just left the mine a little while before it occurred, and no abnormal condition in the mine was noted. At the time of the explosion five machine men were in the mine.

Jan 1, 1925

The 72nd Regular Meeting of the Rocky Mountain Coal Mining Institute convened at The Mark Conference Center, Lionshead Village, Vail, Colorado, and was in session at 10:00 a.m. Past President Roy Coulson, President Kemmerer Coal Company, Frontier, Wyoming, called the meeting to order. He introduced Robert W. Wilson, President of the Institute 1975-1976. Bob's biography follows: Born August 20, 1923 in Washington, D.C.; P-47 Fighter Pilot for three years with the U.S. Air Corps, flying 101 missions, Discharged October 1945; Married Barbara J. Polley August 1945 in Golden, Colorado; Moved to Colorado in 1948; Parents of two sons, Alan born in 1948 and Russell (deceased); Now residents of Conifer, Colorado and planning retirement on ranch property in Santa Rita, New Mexico; His education consists of Elementary and High School in Arlington, Va.; Two years at Virginia Polytechnic Institute, Blacksburg, Va.; B.S. in Mechanical Engineering, Purdue University, Lafayette, Indiana 1948; Business-Salesman for K&P, Inc. since 1949, President and Owner since 1968; Representatives for T. J. Gundlach Co., Johnson-March Corp., Ramsey Engineering Co., Omni-Lift, Smoot Company, Sweco, Inc. and FMC-Syntron; Member, RMCMI since 1957, Served as Registration Chairman, Reservation Chairman, Member of the Executive Board and Vice President for Colorado; Member, Society Mining Engineers (AIME), Colorado Mining Association, New Mexico Mining Association, Industries for Jefferson County, and Denver Coal Club.

Jan 1, 1976

By Samuel Tescher

The operation of gaseous mines is a problem, due to the fact that we have not only the ordinary mine accidents to guard against, but have also the ever present menace of a mine disaster involving a large number of human lives, and the destruction of valuable property. In looking over the reports of mine disasters throughout the country in the past several years, we find that methane gas, coming in contact with an ignition agency of some kind, has been the source of at least 75 per cent of our mine explosions. Coal dust, of course, plays its part in propagating the explosive action throughout the mine workings and rendering it more violent and destructive; nevertheless, the initial ignition of a body of explosive gas-sometimes of very small volume-has been the primer for the large majority of our mine disasters. We find also, that the places of initial ignition are most frequently found at the working faces, or in close proximity thereto. This is mainly due to the following reasons: First-The working faces are, as a rule, the places where methane gas is most freely generated. Second: They are places that are most poorly ventilated. Third-They are the places where ignition agencies are most frequently found. The sources of ignition, as a rule, consist of naked lights, the shooting -of shots, defective flame safety lamps, and electrical arcs. The problem, then, in the operation of gaseous mines, is primarily to so ventilate the working faces that an explosive mixture is not likely to occur, and to endeavor to keep away from the working faces all sources of ignition. To do both of these things may seem impossible. Nevertheless, by working along both of these directions, a great many disasters can be avoided. The efficient ventilation of the working faces is paramount. By efficient ventilation, we mean the continuous passing of large volumes of air at the working faces. This can only be accomplished by adequate ventilating equipment, capable of being driven by at least two independent and distinct sources of power, together with large, clean, straight air courses which are free of short turns, constructed areas, and leaky doors and stoppings. In other words, furnish a suitable course for its travel through the mine. Many of us sharpen our pencils and rack our brains to properly estimate the proper size pump and pipe equipment that may be needed to handle a certain amount of water. We estimate the size of copper conductors to a nicety. We immediately rush to repair leaks in our water, compressed air or electric lines. But how many of us give serious thought to the travel of the air through our mines, the health and safety-giving fluid on which so much depends! In driving air courses, a certain economical cross-sectional area should be adopted and maintained as standard. When turns are necessary, they should be made with long radius curves, and the cross-sectional area should be increased on the curves. All entry stoppings should preferably be built of monolithic concrete, with suitable hitches into floor and ribs, and after the concrete has set, they should be examined and leaks due to shrinkage and settling should be eliminated. Overcasts and their approaches should have cross-sectional areas larger than the entries leading to them, to allow for the sudden change of direction, bearing in mind that air wants to travel in straight lines. In the early development of a property, ample provision should be made in the size of the main entry pillars to allow for the driving of additional

Jan 1, 1925

The eighth annual RMCMI Mine Rescue Evaluation was held during the 1999 Institute convention at the Crested Butte Marriott Resort, Colorado. [ ] Elliott Tsosie, Mary Rowell, Janna Aune, Guy Horton, Art Saenz and Bill Balaz were pleased with the 1999 Mine Rescue Program, The Mine Rescue committee is but one of 17 volunteer committees; this one co-chaired by Bill Balaz, Elliott Tsosie and Janna Aune. There were three evaluators, Art Saenz, Western Environmental; Mary Rowell, ProCare and Guy Horton, Horton Rope Rescue. Nine teams participated and brought 89 participants, 26 spouses, nine children and five teens. The teams were BHP LaPlata, BHP Navajo, BHP San Juan, all from Farmington, NM; Bridger Coal Co., Rock Springs, WY; The Coteau Properties Co., Beulah, ND; Northwestern Resources, Jewett, TX; Powder River Coal Co., Gillette, WY; Solvay Minerals, Green River, WY and Western Energy Co., Colstrip, MT. To observe were members from Centralia Mining Co., Centralia, WA. [ ] Evaluators: Mary Rowell, Guy Horton &Art Saenz The three professional evaluators provided challenging scenarios for the Mine Rescue participants on the grounds of the resort property. Some attending convention were alarmed to see stretchers with "victims" and phoned the hotel switchboard to report the catastrophe. Team members had no prior knowledge of what the scenarios might be and derails were provided only as they arrived at the scenario location, with one exception. Seven to ten or more articipants make up each team. Some teams also ring an alternate and team trainer. For identification purposes, the "victims" wore white shirts emblazoned both front and back with a red VICTIM designation. There was a staged demonstration by three response teams who had not previously worked together. This was enacted on the convention floor following a Technical Session meeting attended by about 200 members. Three response teams from BHP's Navajo and San Juan Mines together with Coteau Properties' Freedom Mine provided a demonstration of their response skills. For never having worked together before, they presented a very professional enactment. This is described at length in the Welcome Session copy. Training sessions were held Saturday and Sunday to enable the teams to prepare for the scenarios. A swap meet was Saturday evening for teams to swap hats, shirts, belt buckles, stickers etc. Each participant received a royal blue golf shirt and ivory cap with royal blue bill. Culmination of the Mine Rescue program was a Tuesday morning Awards breakfast when teams were presented with jade acrylic plaques. [ ] Teams participating in the Mine Rescue Evaluation received trophies on Tuesday morning. The captains above represent BHP-La Plata, BHP-Navajo, BHP¬San Juan, Bridger Coal Co., The Coteau Properties Co., Powder River Coal Co., Solvay Minerals, and Western Energy Co. Sponsors who contributed financially to the 1999 Mine Rescue program were Balaz & Associates, CMC, Civil Constructors, Colstrip Electric, Farmington Fire Equipment & Safety, Fisher Safety, Flanders Ellctric Motor Service, Magnum Metals, Richard Palmtag, Rocky Mountain Electric Motors, Sedona Consulting and Western Water Consultants. [ ] Evaluator Art Saenz likes to have the upper hand and will take whatever steps necessary to get it.

Jan 1, 1999

[Adams, Dell H Consolidation Coal Co., 3300 One Oliver Plaza, Pittsburgh, Pa. Adams, Douglas K General Electric Co., P.O. Box 2331, Denver 1, Colo. Adams, Kenneth L Peabody Coal Co., 33 Carnation Dr., Belleville, Ill. Ahlborg, William Joy Mfg. Co., 580 Denver Club, Bldg., Denver, Colorado Albrechtsen, Ray H Mt. States Resources Corp., 2330 S. Main, Salt Lake City, Utah Allen, Dr. Harry C U. S. Bureau of Mines, Washington, D. C. 20242 Amerman, Richard W Utah Cons. & Mining Co., Box 155, Fruitland, New Mexico Anderson, G. A Walker Bank & Trust Co., 848 N 3rd E, Price, Utah Anderson, John S. Utah Cons. & Mining Co., 550 California St., San Francisco, Calif. Anderson, Robert Mine Safety Appliances Co., 1881 West N. Temple, Salt Lake City, Utah]

Jan 1, 1971

BHP-Utah International, Inc. Coal Magazine Crane & Hoist Sales, Inc. Cummins Southwest, Inc. Cyprus Coal Company Harnischfeger Corporation Hemscheidt Corporation Jennmar Corporation Joy Technologies, Inc. K&P Sales Engineers, Inc. Kennametal, Inc. Kerr McGee Coal Corporation McLanahan Corporation National Mine Service Company The North American Coal Corporation Peabody Coal Company Pittsburg & Midway Coal Mining Co. Roberts & Schaefer Company Santa Fe Pacific Coal Corporation Southern Pacific Lines Tamarron Resort Utah Power & Light Company Utility Fuel

Jan 1, 1991

[Page Officers of the Institute 5 Minutes of Twenty-first Meeting 9 The U. S. Fuel Company's Tipple at the Hiawatha Mine John M. Jennings 11 Some Experiences With Mechanical Loading in Central Pennsylvania¬ O. G. Sharrer 13 Mechanical Loading Underground- A. W. Dickinson 25 Operation by Long-Face Conveyor Method at Sweetwater Mine Glen A. Knox 39 Discussion of Mechanical Loading 44 Discussion-Safety in Mechanical Loading 45 New Steel Tipple, Spring Canyon, Utah- G. A. Murphy 46 A Theory on the Cause of Spontaneous Combustion-C. P. Crawford... 48 Rock Dusting in the West-D. Harrington 50 Mudite-L. C. Clare 57 Discussion of Harrington's and Clare's Papers 59 Material for Rock Dust-Prepared Discussion-Edward K. Judd 60 Tipple and Mine of the Columbia Steel Corporation-T. C. Harvey 63 Mechanical Stoking of Domestic Fuel-Joseph Harrington 67 The Garrison Automatic Domestic Stoker-Lloyd Garrison 70 Discussion of Domestic Stokers 71]

Jan 1, 1925

By Andrew Franklin

The eightieth regular meeting and convention was called to order by the President, John T. Atkins, at 9:15 a.m. Monday, June 25, 1984 in the Colorado Ballroom of the Marriott's Mark Resort in Vail, Colorado. President Atkins welcomed the members and their guests to the convention and noted that the annual business meeting would be held Tuesday afternoon at 2:00 p.m. in the same room. A convention update was made by the Conven¬tion Liaison Officer, Loren V. Linville. This was followed with a program report by the Program Chairman, Doug Ingram. The chair then called on Clifford Barrett, Upper Colorado Regional Director of the Bureau of Rec¬lamation of the United States Department of the Interior. He presented the Bureau's Citizen Award to RMCMI former president Ira E. McKeever for his outstanding contributions to the joint private/ Federal effort and the open planning process for AQUATRAIN. According to Barrett, "from 1981 to early 1984, McKeever led private industry work in the AQUATRAIN project, a proposal for a 1,400 mile long pipeline system. AQUATRAIN was conceived as a possible alternative to solve the government's problem of rising salinity levels in the Colorado river, as well as the private sector's need for a more economical coal transport method. The Citizen Award cites McKeever's efforts in developing a model for future cooperative ventures between government and industry that can benefit the nation." Following this presentation, the formal program of the 80th meeting and convention began with the president, John Atkins, introducing the convention kickoff speaker, Andrew Franklin, President of Nerco Mining Co., Inc., followed by the convention keynote speaker, Dr. Margaret N. Maxey of the University of Texas. These speeches are printed in this Proceedings together with those of all other convention speakers. I'm Andrew Franklin, President of Nerco Min¬ing Company, and I'm delighted to be here to kick off the annual convention of the Rocky Mountain Coal Mining Institute. This has always been a very special convention in my eyes and I'm sure this year's will be no exception. I am also here to share my thoughts on the western coal industry and how we're all affected - for good and bad - by public policy decisions. Although the title of my talk is "Western Coal: An Industry Under Siege," I believe a more accurate title might be "Western Coal: The Pit and The Pendulum," because of the wide swings in public policy and coal development in the past 15 years which have cut a zigzag path for growth over this period. As one of the nation's largest coal producers, Nerco is well aware of the problems facing western coal production. Nerco Mining Company is the western coal mining subsidiary of Nerco Inc. We have been "in coal" for more than 25 years through our parent company, Pacific Power & Light. To state my conclusion at the outset, I feel it's extremely important that consistency and common sense should guide our national policy for the development of valuable energy resources. In particu¬lar, we must reduce the wide swings in government policy and activities which have affected energy development. In short, we must decide what kind of game we're playing so that the "players" and the "referees" can keep their eyes on the "ball." Business today faces two main types of uncertainty market uncertainty and public policy uncertainty. As businessmen, we expect and are used to facing the familiar challenges and uncertainties of the market in which we operate. Over the past 10 years, the market has appeared to be bullish on coal. But the facts make our future less rosy. Last year, western coal producers faced over 50 million

Jan 1, 1984

The 78th Regular Meeting of the Rocky Mountain Coal Mining Institute (hereafter referred to as RMCMI) convened at the Marriott's Mark Conference Center, Lionshead Village in Vail, Colorado. The meeting was called to order at 8:45 a.m. by the President, Ira E. McKeever, Jr., who is President, Western Mining Operations, Natural Resources Group, W. R. Grace & Co. McKeever was introduced by Past President Edward F. Ziolkowski, Senior Vice President and General Manager, Energy Development Company in Hanna, Wyoming. MR. ZIOLKOWSKI: The first order of business this morning is to introduce the president and for a business meeting as well as other items on the program. It is my pleasure to introduce Ira McKeever to you this morning. Ira was born and raised in Kit Carson, Colorado, and served in the U.S. Navy prior to obtaining his geological engineering degree in 1952 from Colorado School of Mines in Golden. He then spent the next 20 years involved in mining sulphur, pot ash and coal with Texas Gulf Sulphur at that time and Gulf Resources Chemical Corporation. In 1972 he joined W. R. Grace & Co. as president of the Mining Division, Natural Resources Group. He was named Colowyo Coal Company's president and general manager in 1976 to develop what is currently Colorado's largest coal surface mining operation. Last year he became W. R. Grace's president of Western Mining Operations which is the position he presently holds. Ira is active in civic affairs; he is currently serving on the Colorado Energy Impact Assistance Advisory Committee. He is a member of the Colorado's Metropolitan Water Roundtable, he is also a director of Project Colorado, a member of the committee for the Colorado Division of Commerce and Industry. He has, in the past, served as chair- man of the Craig Hospital Board. In 1967 Ira was the recipient of the Colorado School of Mines van Diest Gold Medal Award, and in 1981 was given the individual service award for outstanding accomplishments in the field of health, promotion, physical fitness by Colorado's Governor's Council for the Health and Promotion of Physical Fitness. Memberships are also held in Denver Coal Club, the Colorado Mining Association, and the American Mining Congress. Will you please welcome Ira McKeever? I do have one other piece of business here. If you will all join with me, yesterday was Ira's birthday. I asked what year that was, but I couldn't get that out. So, I'm not going to lead the singing. Someone is going to lead the singing. But I think it would be appropriate if we did sing happy birthday this morning and I think it would also wake us up. How's that? All right, will you join me please? (A chorus of the Happy Birthday song followed.) President McKeever's address: MR. McKEEVER: The secret is that I'm double nickles. So I've got a few more years hopefully to be with you and this wonderful industry that we represent. Thank you Ed. I realize now more than ever, the tremendous effort that you put in the program last year and the magnitude of the job that is placed in the presidency of the Institute. It was indeed with tremulous hands that I undertook to lead the Institute this year, and I found a tremendous amount of strength and guidance in my friend Ed whom we've known since college days and worked together. On behalf of that lifetime of memories and good thoughts, Ed, I would like to present to you a little token of appreciation. 1 would like to join Ed in welcoming you all to Vail. Ed arranged the weather, 1 arranged the program along with Charlie Margolf. This is the 70th regular meeting of the Rocky Mountain Coal Mining Institute; and in accepting the leadership a year ago, 1 obligated one very special person to fill the role of chairlady and hostess for this meeting. I would like to have you all, if you haven't already, meet my wife, Linda. I would like to thank her publicly for her guidance and help she continues to provide me. It's absolutely necessary that you also meet and recognize Charlie Margolf our program chairman who will be helping through the meeting to present and monitor our program; and anyone who knows Charlie knows the sincerity and dedication he brings to anything or any phase of life he touches. We will be seeing him in action this afternoon when he chairs the most interesting panel presentations. Don't miss it if you can help it. A couple of logistical comments. We will have to keep our meeting on schedule so that any of our non-agenda items that we need to keep, maybe we

Jan 1, 1982