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Discussion of the paper presented at the Manchester Geological and Mining Society's general meeting held in Manchester, April 11th 1916, with Mr. Leonard R. Fletcher, President, in the chair, included questions asked and points for discussion raised by Bramall V., Paton J.D., Fletcher L.R., Siddall F.N., Stoker A. and Stone T., in particular on how to eliminate dust

Dec 1, 1916

Discussion of the paper presented at the North Staffordshire Institute of Mining and Mechanical Engineers' general meeting held in Stoke-on-Trent, March 27th 1916, with Mr. John Gregory, President, in the chair, included contributions by Gregory J., Cadman J., Hartley J.W., Wain E.B. and Henshaw A.M., followed by the author's reply

Dec 1, 1916

By Gibson J.

Written discussion contributions to the paper presented at the North of England Institute of Mining and Mechanical Engineers' general meeting held in Newcastle-upon-Tyne, 12th February 1916, with Mr. T.Y. Greener, President, in the chair, comprise comments by Kilpatrick W.M., Routledge W.H., Watson J. and Smith W., along with the author's reply. Also briefly noted are the demonstration of two pieces of equipment, an incline chock and a cage arrestor

Dec 1, 1916

Jan 1, 1952

(SECRETARY'S NOTE.) The following discussion of the papers of Van Hise, Emmons, Lindgren and Weed, read at the Washington meeting, February, 1900, and printed on pp. 282 to 498 of this volume, comprises communications to the Secretary, received at various times before the Richmond meeting, February, 1901, and, for the most part, presented at that meeting. These communications are introduced at this point in the present volume, in order that they may precede the papers of Vogt, hemp, Lindgren, Rickard, etc., presented at Richmond, and therefore not forming part of the material considered in them. Since many of the contributors have mentioned in one communication several of the papers referred to, no attempt is here made to divide their remarks and distribute the fragments under separate headings. In each contribution, however, the several topics are indicated by subtitles. R. BECK,* Freiberg, Saxony : Prof. Veal Hise's Paper.-The paper of Prof. Van use (p. 282) represents a great step of scientific progress, in that the circulation of underground waters has never before been presented with such clearness, ill the light of modern chemical and physical knowledge. The theories of the formation of ore-deposits which follow the author's general survey of the currents and solvent power of atmospheric waters in the earth's crust do not, indeed, seem to be novel, being essentially an amplification of Le Conte's views; but the proofs adduced in their support are in many particulars so original that no one can read without profit this portion of the paper. Entirely new (though largely in agreement with the papers of Emmons and Weed, presented at the same meeting of the Institute) are the sections dealing with the formation of the rich sulphides of the precious metals, and especially the regeneration of normal sulphides, such as galena, etc., in vein-zones immediately beneath the ground-water level. Nevertheless, it appears to me that Prof. Van Hise, in the course of his most instructive exposition of unquestionable, yet still locally limited, phenomena, has been too much biased in favor of the " descensionists." This is indicated by the small importance which he attaches to the intimate genetic relation between epigenetic deposits and the plutonic hearths of the earth's interior.

Jan 1, 1902

Jan 1, 1904

Jan 1, 1951

Jan 1, 1951

J. R. Lane (Metals Research Laboratory, Washington)—A new type of deformation called "kinking" has recently been described. Is there any relation between the "rumpling" described in this paper and "kinking?" D. C. Jillson (author's reply)—Both are manifestations of bending about [210] axis. The difference is one of degree. W. C. Ellis (Bell Telephone Laboratories, New York) —Some observations of deformation in zinc recorded in this paper may be applicable generally to flow in metals. One of these, deformation in torsion without evidence of slip or twinning in the early stages and with startling ease, when the twist is about the hexagonal axis, adds another method of flow to the presently increasing list of mechanisms. This illustrates again that a crystal will utilize any realizable process to flow and relieve stress. The process is not necessarily classical directional slip—& this case, it is rotational slip. The question naturally occurs: Will face-centered cubic metas stressed by twisting about an octahedral axis flow in a similar manner by rotation on an octahedral plane? I would like to ask Dr. Jillson if he has made any experiments or knows of any experiments of this type on face-centered cubic metals? Face-centered cubic metals possibly would behave differently from zinc, since, for one thing, the stacking sequence is different for the two structures. The results of such experiments, however, would be instructive in providing more information about deformation processes. D. C. Jillson—Dr. Roy E. Swift, working in the Hammond Laboratory at Yale, performed a twist test on a single crystal of brass. The work has not been published, and I do not know the crystallographic direction of the axis of the specimen used. Lo-ching Chang (Columbia University, New York)— Observations similar to Figs. 1 and 2 of the paper were obtained by us during the bending and unbending of an orthorhombic Au-Cd alloy.'l This orthorhombic alloy is the product of diffusionless transformation from a single crystal of p Au-Cd alloy (CsC1 structure) containing 47.5 atomic pct Cd on cooling to about 60 "C.62 Referring to the effects of annealing, has the author tried any loilg time high temperature anneal, such as 150 to 200 hr at 40O°C? D. C. Jillson—No. C. Crussard (Ecole des Mines, Paris: France)—I

Jan 1, 1952

G. A. Moore—The tin-fusion method has been a very favorable possibility for many years. The authors apparently have settled the question that delayed the method for a long time by showing that no hydrogen is absorbed in the tin. This, of course, is very important. I want to make a few remarks concerning the absolute accuracy of analysis, which must be the final basis for deciding among the various methods. From the figures in the paper, there seems to be some re-maining slight discrepancy on the actual amount of hydrogen present in various samples which may be presumed essentially identical. (This is of the order of the precision of individual analyses but appears in averaged results.) From the analyst's viewpoint, the tally of hydrogen content can be regarded as occurring in three portions. First is a large portion which comes off easily and automatically during sample storage and later on heating in the apparatus. This is fairly easily analyzed. Second is an item which may be either positive or negative in the tally sheet. In warm or hot evolution, this is a portion which, in practice, can never be re-

Jan 1, 1951

E. A. Peretti (University of Notre Dame, Notre Dame, Ind.)—Mr. Deitz and Professor Halpern are to be congratulated on a fine piece of work which adds to our knowledge of precious metal—cyanide-solution reactions. I should like to offer the following comments: The authors state, "the rate plots were always linear, indicating a zero order reaction rate." This appears to conflict with the data of Fig. 6 which clearly show the rate to vary with the NaCN concentration. It seems to me that the rate curves are linear because of the experimental setup. The volume of solution is so large that over a three-hour period the change in NaCN concentration is very small. A rough calculation for the experiments of Table I where the initial NaCN strength was 0.0096 mol per liter show a change of NaCN concentration of about 0.0009 mol per liter at the end of three hours. In short, over the period of time that the experiment was in progress, the NaCN strength was practically constant; hence the rate of dissolution remained practically constant. Eq. 10, as written, specifies that 1 mol of H202 and 2 mol of hydroxyl ion are formed when 2 mol of silver react. Is this true? The effect of H,O2 on the rate was made in solutions having an oxygen pressure of 4.8 atm. Were any tests made in solutions containing hydrogen peroxide, but no oxygen? G. M. Willis (University of Melbourne, Melbourne, Australia)—The authors have shown that, under their experimental conditions of high O2 concentrations, the rate of solution of silver in aqueous cyanide solutions is controlled by diffusion of O2 or CN- to the metal surface. With diffusion control, it is generally not possible to obtain further information about the mechanism of a process.

Jan 1, 1955

Lester Guttman (General Electric Research Lab-boratory)—Seybolt has measured the thermodynamic activity of silicon in dilute solution in a iron. The anomaly which appears at 800 °C in the approximate range 1 to 6 wt pct Si is most naturally attributed, as Seybolt has done, to the existence of a region of

Jan 1, 1960

A. Blainey (Ministry of Supply, Atomic Energy Research Establishment. Hnrtoell. England)—With ref- erence to the published work of Hausner et al. on the powder metallurgy of zirconium, it will be of interest to summarize briefly the results of preliminary work we have carried out on this subject at A.E.R.E., Harwell. For the early experiments we used zirconium

Jan 1, 1953

Impact Transition Temperatures of Some Pearlite-Free Mild Steels As Affected by Heat Treatments in the Alpha Range H. P. Tardif (Canadian Armament Research and Development Establishment, Quebec)—Mr. Josefsson is to be congratulated for his study of a most difficult subject and for the theories proposed to explain the re- sults. One point which, however, might not have received proper attention is that of the shape of the stress-strain curve at the yield point of quenched and furnace-cooled specimens and of specimens strain aged

Jan 1, 1956

R. L. Fleischer (Department of Metallurgy, Massachusetts Institute of Technology)— The authors have presented valuable observations of oehavior of aluminum at intermediate and high temperatures. I should like to consider their interpretation of the appearance of cross slip plane traces in sample B-3 as partly due to "bending of the crystal due to grip constraint." Because bending moments might be set

Jan 1, 1960

Jan 1, 1958

P. L. Pratt (University of Birmingham, Birmingham, England)—The author has measured the hardening effect of isolated edge and screw dislocation boundaries in a remarkably elegant manner, and he proposes that the detailed structure of the boundary determines its effectiveness as a barrier to slip although "there are still unknown details of the distribution which may be extremely important." On p. 678 the author states "that for a good crystal (one having a yield of about 30 psi) a change in annealing temperature from 300" to 400 °C resulted in a negligible shift in the level of the stress-strain curve." Is this in agreement with the results of the earlier paper by Li, Washburn, and Parker8 in which such a change of temperature produced notable hardening in crystals with a yield of about 30 psi? Or were these earlier crystals, of the same nominal purity, less perfect than those used in this work? The experiment illustrated in Fig. 15, p. 681, shows that the boundary has sharpened after annealing at 400 °C, the temperature at which the hardening effect first becomes apparent. Did the author verify that no sharpening of the boundary occurred at, say, 300 °C where no hardening was found? This would seem to be an important check on the proposed mechanism, especially since zinc of this purity should polygonize at temperatures well below 400 °C within the annealing times used here. There seem to be at least two alternative explanations which could fit these facts: 1—The boundary may sharpen at 300 °C or even lower temperatures but be unable to contribute greatly to the hardening until jogged by thermal vacancies and other impurity atoms after 400 °C anneal. This mechan- ism, discussed in the earlier paper,' is believed to account for the thermal hardening observed by Blank'" in NaCl, as stated elsewhere: and by results from recent experiments which tend to confirm this view. 2—The dislocations in the diffuse boundary may be locked by impurity atoms at 300 °C and thus only sharpen the boundary at 400 °C with the aid of thermal vacancies. In this case it would be difficult to distinguish between the two sources of hardening (sharpening or jogging), using metal of this purity. Jack Washburn (author's reply)—The author wishes to thank Dr. Pratt for his discussion. In connection with his first comment, it should be pointed out that the temperature of testing in the present series of experiments was —196°C, whereas, in the earlier experiments he referred to,' it was 20°C. Therefore, the yield values should not be directly compared. It is likely that the crystals used in the present work were initially more perfect macroscopically than the large shear specimens used previously. The small size of the test section in the kink specimens made it possible to select regions of the large crystals, from which they were acid-cut, that were free of observable small angle boundaries. The sharpening of a microscopically diffuse boundary such as that in Fig. 15 begins in zinc of this purity well below 300°C. However, it is probably not justified to conclude that because a boundary looks sharp under the microscope it has attained the ideal structure. The author agrees with Dr. Pratt that jogging of dislocation lines is one of the structural features of a small angle boundary that should be important in determining its strengthening effect. More detailed information concerning the changes in boundary structure as a

Jan 1, 1956

J. D. Fast and J. L. Meijering (Philips Research Laboratories, N. V. Philips' Gloeilampenfabrieken, Eindhoven, Netherlands)— After the departure of our friend Dijkstra to the United States, investigations on the effect of alloying elements on the behavior of nitrogen in a iron were continued in Eindhoven. We too found internal friction curves with two separate peaks for iron containing nitrogen in addition to 0.5 atomic pct V or 0.5 atomic pct Mo. Our first publication on these investigations" appeared almost simultaneously with the paper now under discussion. At first sight our experimental results seem to be in harmony with their conclusions, but a closer examination reveals that in the case of the Fe-V-N alloy the abnormal peak is not controlled by one time of relaxation only. Whereas iron containing 0.5 atomic pct Mn or Mo absorbs an amount of nitrogen of about the same magnitude as that absorbed by pure iron under identical conditions, iron containing vanadium absorbs in addition one nitrogen atom for every vanadium atom. This last amount, far exceeding the first amount in the case under consideration, combines chemically with the vanadium and causes no internal friction. The "free" nitrogen in the vanadium alloy gives rise not only to a damping peak corresponding to that in pure iron but— due to the presence of VN particles in the metal—also to the abnormal peak at higher temperatures. The VN particles create interstitial sites around themselves where the free nitrogen atoms are bound much tighter than in the normal interstices. These abnormal interstices, therefore, will capture free nitrogen atoms rapidly, whereupon these give rise to the abnormal damping. The binding energy in the abnormal interstices is not the same for all, and with coarsening of the VN precipitate the distribution of these energies is displaced toward the side of stronger binding. This is deduced from a shift of the summit of the second peak toward higher temperatures (from 80" to 88°C in our experiments) caused by prolonged heating at 950°C. From the intermediate state where they cause the abnormal damping, the nitrogen atoms pass over rather rapidly into the fully precipitated state (iron

Jan 1, 1954

Jan 1, 1953

C. M. Bishop (Aircraft Div., A. V. Roe Cnnada Ltd., Toronto)—Reference is made to the coherency hardening of ß due to ß' and also to the hardening of ß due to a coherent precipitation of the a phase. What is meant by the term "ß'?" Would not the coherency hardening of ß during cooling be due to precipitation of a sub-microscopic dispersion of a, as is the case during reheating a ß-quenched alloy? I feel that these two phenomena are essentially the same mechanism, i.e., precipitation of a from unstable or supersaturated ß. From the text, it would appear that Tables III and IV are intended to show the effect of the martensite transformation on the properties of Ti-Mn alloys. Referring to Table 111, the ß-quenched alloys would contain a greater proportion of retained ß than would the equilibrated alloy. Could not the increase in properties be attributed to this, along with possible coherency hardening of the ß? In the same way, the structures referred to in Table IV contain ß from which they could derive their hardness. It would appear to be difficult, if not impossible, to assess the role of the martensite transformation from the data contained in these tables. F. C. Holden, H. R. Ogden, and R. I. Jaffee (authors' reply)—In reply to the first question raised by Mr. Bishop, the term "ß"' designates an apparent retained-p structure which is harder than it is after the most rapid cooling from the ß field. It is thought to be the result of a coherent precipitation of a. The mechanism by which hardening takes place is undoubtedly the same as that involved in the early stages of aging of a re-tained-p structure, and we are in agreement with Mr. Bishop on this point. The term "ß'" to designate the anomalously hard retained-ß structure was agreed upon at a symposium in 1953." The authors do not agree that the quantity of retained ß and/or ß' in the ß-quenched specimens of Table III is necessarily greater than that of the 600°C equilibrated specimens. The ß-quenched specimen has a structure which appears to be completely a' formed by the martensite reaction. It is recognized that there could be some retained ß (or ß') between the a plates if the M, temperature is below room temperature. This is unlikely for the 3.4 pct Mn alloy where the M, is known to be at about 640°C. Therefore, the increase in strength cannot be attributed to the presence of a greater quantity of coherency-hardened ß, but, rather, the increase in strength must be attributed to the transformation products formed, e.g., a' (martensiti-cally formed a). Concerning the data in Table IV, we agree that it is difficult to estimate the role of the martensite reaction, since the 6.4 pct Mn alloy was retained ß in the quenched condition.

Jan 1, 1955